Radio Free Beszel

Pandemic of Hate

Alphonse Season 1 Episode 10

"Treat them like the plague-spreading lepers that they are. You want to be put in isolation camps? That's where this is headed, you will have deserved it, and I'm all for it."
— highly up-voted comment on Reddit, September, 2021

There is an epidemic of hate against the unvaccinated. Our leaders call them dangers to society, encouraging widespread hate. They are being fired from their jobs and ostracized. People wish death on them. Gluboco Lietuva, for example, explains the impact of the policies and the hate on himself and his family.

The formation of mass hate follows the pattern of totalitarianism. Dutch psychologist Mattias Desmet, echoing  René Girard's description of the scapegoat ritual, calls this mass formation: a form of collective hypnosis. A minority of the population, suffering from social isolation, anxiety, meaninglessness and anger are effectively hypnotized. Their fears and frustrations focus on a target. The possibility of violence rises. Most of us are not hypnotized: but history shows that if we go along with the spirit of hate, the probability of atrocities rises.

Though I chose to be vaccinated, fear where this will lead.

0:00
Good evening. This is
Radio Free Beszel. I

0:04
am Alphonse. Tonight:
The Pandemic of Hate.

0:09
"a false, treacherous and
contemptible swine: this

0:12
was shameful Israel, the
wicked and disloyal who

0:15
hated good and loved everything
evil, who then

0:17
poisoned several rivers
and fountains so that

0:20
many lost their lives;
for whoever used them

0:23
died suddenly. Then every
Jew was destroyed,

0:26
some hanged, others burned, some
were drowned, others beheaded."

0:33
"under conditions like these,
there are people

0:35
who deliberately take
sides with the enemy

0:38
and must be treated
accordingly. In

0:41
times of war, such
people were shot."

0:44
"Treat them like the
plague-spreading lepers

0:47
that they are. You want
to be put in isolation

0:49
camps? That's where
this is headed, you

0:51
will have deserved it,
and I'm all for it."

0:56
The first quote I just read
was from Guillaume

0:59
de Machaut in 1349, during
the Black Death when

1:02
the people in the town
where he was decided

1:05
that the Jews were responsible
for the plague,

1:07
and murdered them. The second
quote was by Arūnas

1:11
Valinskas, a Lithuanian
public intellectual

1:14
and a former parliamentarian,
in September, 2021.

1:19
The third quote was from
a reddit discussion in

1:23
Canada, also in September
'21. The post was

1:26
highly - extraordinarily
highly - upvoted,

1:30
with many awards. I have
never seen hate like

1:33
this. I've never seen our
leaders encourage us

1:37
to divide and hate and
avoid one another, to

1:40
blame other people for
threatening our lives.

1:44
The closest I recall was
following 9/11 when

1:47
there was widespread blame
of Muslims. But this

1:51
this is much worse. And
the height of it is

1:54
the vaccine mandates, the
vaccine passports.

1:58
I'm vaccinated, by the
way, by choice before

2:02
all the madness began.
But I shouldn't have

2:04
to say that. Here's what
it's like for someone

2:08
who isn't, a Lithuanian
man, Gluboco Lietuva,

2:13
who joined Twitter specifically
to explain what

2:15
it was like for him and
his wife who declined

2:18
the vaccine passport in
his country. He says

2:21
they've been suspended from
their jobs. They can't

2:24
return - and they wouldn't
if they could, because

2:26
their co-workers are sending
death threats.

2:28
They can't get new jobs
in their fields. They

2:31
can't even enter the
supermarkets to buy groceries

2:34
because they're banned
without the passport.

2:36
They have to buy food from
stalls on the street.

2:39
They need to fix their
home but they

2:41
can't go into the
hardware store,

2:42
and they can't even hire someone
to do the repairs

2:46
for them. He writes, "Despite
hardship we decided

2:50
resistance is our moral
path. We want our kids

2:53
some day to feel pride towards
us, not disgust.

2:57
Freedom is fragile, and
we must defend it.

3:01
If not us, then who?
We do not stop you

3:04
earning a living, though
you stop us. We do

3:07
not ban you from buying
food and clothing,

3:10
though you ban us. We
do not hate you,

3:13
though you hate us. We
do not banish you,

3:17
though you banish us.
We do not wish death

3:19
upon you, though you
wish death upon us.

3:23
And when the time comes,
as it inevitably will,

3:26
when you too are banished
by the ever-increasing

3:29
arbitrary rules of the
new authoritarianism,

3:32
we will fight for your rights
just as we fight

3:34
now for ours. Because
we are all equal. We

3:38
all have equal right to
exist in society."

3:44
For me this recalls the famous
poem by Martin Niemöller:

3:48
"First they came for
the Communists, and

3:50
I didn't speak up,
because I wasn't a

3:52
Communist. Then they came
for the Jews, and

3:55
I didn't speak up, because
I wasn't a Jew.

3:58
Then they came for the
Catholics, and I

4:00
didn't speak up, because
I was a Protestant.

4:04
And they came for me,
and by that time

4:06
there was no one left
to speak up for me."

4:13
How have we come to
this? How have we

4:15
come to a time when
we're willing to

4:17
to to hate our fellow
citizens? And

4:20
say that's moral?
And celebrate it?

4:24
How have we come to the
point where we can wish

4:26
for the deaths of our fellow
citizens? Large

4:29
numbers of us? I've heard
hate from people I know.

4:32
When the vaccine passport
came in where I live,

4:35
it was only for non-essential
activities. You can

4:37
go to the library without
one. You can go to the

4:40
grocery store without one.
But you can't go to a

4:42
restaurant. And I spoke to
a friend and he thought

4:44
it was a good idea. And
I thought, oh well, you

4:46
know, because maybe it
can keep people safer.

4:48
But that's not what he said
- no, he said because

4:51
then the unvaccinated will
suffer. They will be

4:54
punished, and that will
encourage them to get the

4:57
shot. Such hate. I didn't
even know what to say.

5:03
There are a number
of interviews on

5:05
YouTube with a Dutch
psychologist

5:07
named Mattias Desmet,
D-E-S-M-E-T. If you search

5:10
for that and his theory
about "mass formation"

5:14
you can also find some
articles summarizing

5:17
it. You'll see what
he has to say.

5:20
He saw this coming before
it happened. He made

5:23
financial decisions in late
2019 because he felt

5:26
that the public was on
the verge of something

5:29
like this. The pandemic
was only the excuse.

5:34
What he explains with
his theory of mass

5:36
formation, which is in
a sense a theory of

5:38
how totalitarianism happens
from the bottom up, is

5:41
that there are four conditions
that lead to people

5:45
joining movements like
this. And these are

5:48
familiar if you listen
to my episodes on

5:51
totalitarianism, where
Hannah Arendt talks

5:54
about similar things, and
with my talk about

5:57
René Girard and scapegoats.
The first of these

6:00
conditions is social isolation,
which has been

6:04
increasing for a variety
of reasons in the

6:07
1990s, and then with social
media even more,

6:11
and now with lockdowns even
more still, to the

6:13
point where many people have
few friends or none.

6:18
The second, he says,
is a failure of

6:20
sense-making, a lack
of meaning in life.

6:24
And we see people expressing
that all the

6:27
time. The third is free-floating
anxiety.

6:30
Free-floating means it doesn't
have a target -

6:32
people are just anxious,
they feel that they're

6:34
precarious or something's
going to go wrong. And

6:37
that's certainly the case
in the economy and the

6:40
incredible competition,
which I've also talked

6:42
about in previous episodes
about the information

6:45
economy and elite
overproduction. And fourth

6:48
and finally there's a sense
of free-floating

6:51
aggression and anger. And
I think it's clear

6:55
that we saw this well
before the pandemic.

7:00
And what Desmet says
is that when all

7:03
of these conditions
are fulfilled,

7:05
that people are feeling
miserable

7:07
and they want to
find a way out.

7:12
If they're given a
target and told,

7:14
this is the source
of your troubles,

7:16
they may turn on that
target. And with a

7:19
feeling of self-sacrifice,
a feeling of elation,

7:22
of ecstasy - he says it's
almost like a hypnotic

7:24
state where people don't
even notice the things

7:27
that are lost. They don't
notice the costs of

7:29
their actions. They don't
notice other harms

7:31
that are happening in the
world, because they

7:33
just focused on that target
that they blame for

7:36
everything that's wrong.
And that's when they

7:38
become capable of great
atrocities, he says.

7:42
This parallels almost exactly
René Girard's theory

7:45
that I talked about in Contagion
and Scapegoat,

7:49
where the strife in society
and the distinctions

7:51
have broken down and people
are blaming each

7:54
other, but then all of a
sudden they turn as one

7:57
on a single target, a group
or an individual,

8:00
and they scapegoat and
destroy and expel

8:03
that target. And then
harmony is restored,

8:06
because they're all on the
same side again. Desmet

8:09
says though that not everybody
signs up for this.

8:13
He says that about 30 percent
join the ecstasy,

8:16
about 30 percent are effectively
hypnotized.

8:20
Another 40 percent go
along - they're not

8:23
ecstatic, but they follow
the lead of the few.

8:27
And the final 30 percent
are opposed. They see

8:30
what's happening and they
fight against it. He

8:33
says there's no pattern that
predicts who will be

8:36
in this group. They come
from all walks of life,

8:38
they come from all political
philosophical

8:41
and religious backgrounds,
but they unite

8:43
against the tragedy they
see unfolding before

8:47
them. And often they too
can become targets.

8:52
I know the people who hate
think they're justified.

8:57
They think they're
justified because

8:58
they think they're
right. They think

8:59
they have the truth -
and maybe they do,

9:01
but then the people during
the Black Death

9:04
also thought they had the
truth when they blamed

9:07
the Jews, and they were wrong.
Who are we to claim

9:10
that we uniquely have
the truth? Those who

9:13
are most confident are
often most in error.

9:18
But even if they do have
the truth, does

9:20
that justify these kinds
of behaviors?

9:23
If we look back in history,
is there any

9:26
time that jumps out as
being a good time

9:28
when it was the right
thing to do to

9:30
blame a few people for
what was wrong,

9:33
to expel a group from
society, to deny them

9:36
participation, to deny their
humanity, to describe

9:39
them as enemies and vermin?
Has that ever been

9:43
the right thing to do? I
can't think of a time.

9:48
The second argument that
they will make is

9:51
that this protects the
community. If we can

9:53
make those few people go
along, if we can all

9:55
get vaccinated, then it
will end the pandemic.

9:59
But even if that were true
- and despite all

10:02
the virtues of the vaccine
that persuaded me

10:04
to take it, it isn't - even
if that were true,

10:08
forcing people is not going
to persuade them to

10:11
come on-side. Some of them
will, but the cost

10:14
to protecting the community
is destroying it.

10:18
If you hate people like
this, if you treat

10:20
them as second-class citizens
and outsiders,

10:23
how do you expect to have
a community after

10:25
that? What happens next
time when you want

10:27
people on your side to
do the right thing?

10:30
They won't join because
you broke it. It's

10:33
better to persuade. It's
better to recognize that

10:36
people have the right to
make their own mistakes.

10:41
It's better to realize that
we as citizens are not

10:43
judge jury and executioner,
to go and decide who's

10:46
good and who's bad. It's
better to have a society

10:50
where we're all treated as
equals and we all have

10:54
access to due process.
But there's the third

10:58
reason, a third reason
that is seldom spoken:

11:03
which is that people hate
because it feels good.

11:07
Because they think they're
so angry that they

11:10
can't keep it in. "Who could
blame me for hating

11:13
people who put my family at
risk," they might say.

11:18
Well, I will. I will, even
though I've made the

11:21
mistakes so many times myself,
and I'm sure I'll

11:24
make it again. But hate is
not bound to targets.

11:28
It's like an energy that flows.
Once you have hate

11:33
it spreads. Other people
mirror it. Other

11:35
people echo it back to
you. It spreads, it

11:38
shifts from target to target.
Girard talks about

11:41
this - how the scapegoat
can first be one group,

11:45
and then another as different
scapegoats

11:47
attract more and more
people, until finally

11:50
the majority fixate on one
target. Desmet says

11:53
this too. He suggests that
maybe the solution

11:57
is to shift the target
- the target of fear,

12:00
the target of anxiety -
away from the pandemic,

12:02
away from the unvaccinated,
and towards

12:05
the rising totalitarianism
that we see.

12:09
Girard's solution is different.
His solution

12:12
in a word, although he doesn't
use it, is Love.

12:15
It is to say that we need
to understand that

12:20
the scapegoat is innocent.
And that's true too,

12:24
in the sense that we're
all flawed, we're all

12:27
guilty, and we're all innocent.
The most frequent

12:31
accusation I've seen thrown
at the unvaccinated

12:34
is that they're stupid. What
kind of society would

12:38
we be if that were really
true? If we would say

12:40
that some people are endowed
with intelligence,

12:42
some people are endowed
with stupidity,

12:45
and the stupid
should suffer.

12:49
Or maybe we're lying
about it. Maybe we

12:51
don't really mean that
they're stupid.

12:52
Maybe we mean something
else. But then why are

12:55
we saying the wrong thing?
And I think that's the

12:58
case. And I think it reveals
a guilty conscience.

13:01
We say they're stupid but
we mean something else.

13:05
But if we really said
something else we

13:07
might look bad, so we just
call them stupid.

13:11
The point is, we can't
afford hate.

13:13
Hate won't protect
us from the virus.

13:16
Hate won't sustain
the community that

13:18
we claim we're trying
to protect.

13:22
Hate will only produce
hate. Hate will only

13:24
produce division. Hate won't
solve the problems

13:27
that cause the anxiety,
the precariousness,

13:30
the misery, the isolation
that many people

13:33
live in today. As Desmet
says, those root

13:35
causes are the things
we need to address.

13:40
But some people don't want
those root causes to

13:42
go away, because they benefit.
And we probably

13:45
shouldn't hate them either,
for the same reasons,

13:47
but the fact is it's in
their interests to find

13:50
something else to distract
us with. Because then

13:53
we might look at the
skyrocketing inequality in

13:56
our society, then we might
look at the actual

13:59
meaninglessness of many
of our lives, then we

14:02
might look at the fact that
progress seems to be

14:05
failing. This is the theory
of John Michael Greer,

14:08
that all this insanity is
because originally God

14:11
died in the 19th century.
And then we replaced God

14:14
with a new God, the God
of Progress, the God of

14:17
Man. And now the God of Progress
is failing too.

14:22
But whatever the root
causes, right now

14:25
what we need to do is
to stop the hate.

14:29
Or I think there could
be atrocities.

14:31
That's not the only mention
that I have seen

14:34
of people calling for
concentration camps

14:37
for the unvaccinated,
concentration camps

14:41
for their neighbors. Desmet
says that it's only

14:44
30 percent that are basically
hypnotized that

14:48
are participating in
Girard's scapegoat

14:50
real ritual enthusiastically.
Another 40

14:53
are going along.
And the reason

14:55
the 40 are going
along is because

14:57
that first 30 are unified,
they have one story,

15:00
they have one project. And
the final 30 percent,

15:04
those who resist, those who
don't want to go along

15:07
with the consensus because
they're so different,

15:11
don't tell a single story.
And so they're

15:13
not as compelling for
those in the middle.

15:16
So those of us who want
to resist this must try

15:19
to at least get along enough
to stop this from

15:22
happening. Because the other
thing Desmet says is

15:25
that although you cannot
persuade the hypnotized,

15:29
you cannot reason with
them. Because if they

15:31
accepted your reasons, then
they would have to

15:33
go back into the hell world
of anxiety and anger

15:36
and a lack of meaning. They
don't want to do that.

15:40
And because they don't
want to do that, they

15:42
stick with the lie, they
stick with the hate.

15:46
But as long as there's
resistance they're

15:48
less likely to do something
terrible.

15:51
He says that mass formation,
the totalitarianism,

15:54
turns really bad. Then
the atrocities happen

15:57
when everybody goes along.
So as long as we resist

16:00
we can hopefully prevent
that from happening.

16:05
Maybe you think I'm
exaggerating. Maybe you

16:08
think I'm panicking. Maybe
you think this time

16:11
what we're doing is justified:
it's a crisis, and

16:14
besides totalitarianism is
about radical ideology.

16:18
What's radical about protecting
the health of the community?

16:24
Totalitarianism isn't about
ideology. There have

16:27
been totalitarians of the
left under Stalin,

16:30
and of the right. The Nazis,
the fascists in

16:34
Italy, the wartime Japanese.
Totalitarianism is

16:38
not about a particular set
of beliefs. It's about

16:42
how we treat people. Do we
respect their dignity,

16:46
their independence,
their rights and

16:48
their responsibilities
and their freedoms

16:50
as individuals? Or do we
treat society as an

16:53
organism, or a machine,
and every person is

16:57
a part of that machine -
a gear in the machine.

17:00
And if the gear doesn't work,
we discard it. Even

17:03
if you were to build such
a machine for a good

17:05
purpose, to protect the health
of the community,

17:10
the machine would then
follow its logic. We

17:12
would have built the
totalitarian mechanisms

17:15
needed to treat us
into parts. Even

17:17
though it was built
for a good purpose,

17:20
that's not how it would stay.
Because that's not

17:23
what it is. The machine
is amoral. The machine

17:25
doesn't care about us. The
machine uses us, and

17:29
if it doesn't have a use
for us it destroys us.

17:33
We have said for generations
now, Never

17:37
Again. I grew up under
the idea Never Again.

17:42
But in order for it
to never happen

17:44
again, we also have
always known

17:47
that it could happen here,
and it could happen now.

17:53
How much evidence do we need? If
we wait until it's conclusive,

17:57
all we will be able to
say is, yes, it did

18:00
happen. We let it happen.
We didn't stop it.

18:05
And then our descendants
a century hence will

18:09
be apologizing for the crimes
that we committed.

18:14
If we want to stop it
happening we have to

18:17
stop it before the crimes.
We have to stop

18:19
it when it's not obvious.
"Treat them like

18:22
the plague-spreading lepers
that they are."

18:27
If it were to happen
here, if it were to

18:30
happen now, wouldn't
it look like this?

18:36
This is Alphonse
for Radio Free

18:39
Beszel. www.beszel.ca.
Good night.